Hermeneutics – Isaac, Rebekah, Esau, Jacob and the kids.

Our heavenly Father, open our eyes and hearts that we may see and understand Your Holy Word. We are so delighted that You have chosen us even before the foundation of the earth. You love us so much Lord. We are not worthy of Your love but only by the blood of Your Son Jesus Christ we are made worthy and we approach Your throne of mercy with all boldness. Father, help us, oh Lord, to see what You want us to see and hear what You want us to hear. Bless the readers here as well for they are Your dear children. Let them also understand and be partakers of the joy that I have in You by Your grace. In Jesus’ name I ask, Amen.

The Bible is filled with types. The Lord said

John 5:39   Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. 

John 15:26   But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:

There are two that testify of Jesus, one is the Scriptures – the Bible, the Word, the letter and the other is His Holy Spirit. These two together bear witness of Jesus Christ in His works.

If we do not find the Lord Jesus Christ in the Scriptures then our reading is in vain. The Bible is not just a moral book with some moral law or a story book but it is life. The whole Bible talks about His plan for His only Begotten Son Jesus Christ. That is a mystery in the Old Testament but in the New Testament times, we Christians have His Holy Spirit within us and it is He alone Who will reveal what is in the heart of the Father.

Luke 8:10   And he said, Unto you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God: but to others in parables; that seeing they might not see, and hearing they might not understand.

The lives of Adam, Enoch, Methuselah, Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Joseph and many others in the Old Testament tell us about Jesus Christ. The Lord Jesus Christ is hidden in their lives in a mystery but unto others that are without, their lives are just parables, good moral stories; even to some their lives are examples. Many would agree with me that the whole Bible is one single story about One Man, that is Jesus Christ.

Let us look into one such type in the Old Testament from Gen 27. One has to read the whole chapter before trying to understand the revelation here. But I just want to give you a summary of the chapter here.

The Bible tells us that Esau, the eldest son of Isaac sold his birthright to his younger twin brother Jacob (Gen 25). Esau married the daughters of Heth and that was a grief to his parents, Isaac and Rebekah. Jacob was beloved of Rebekah while Esau, his father Isaac’s (Gen 26:34,35).

Now, Isaac was old and wanted to bless his sons. Being the eldest, he calls Esau and tells him to bring venison, so that he could bless him. This, Rebekah heard (Gen 27:6) and tells her son Jacob to bring two good kids of goat and then she cooks the meat, such as Isaac loved. Jacob resists for fear at first but later obeys. After Rebekah has cooked, she puts the goodly raiment of his brother Esau and the skins of the goat on his hands and his neck and Jacob takes the food to his father. Esau was a hairy man. He goes to Isaac and Isaac feels Jacob, eats the meat that was cooked according to his pleasing and blesses Jacob leaving NOTHING for his brother, Esau. After Esau comes and finds out that Jacob had taken away the blessings, he said in HIS HEART, “I will slay my brother once my father is dead”. This thing which was spoken IN THE HEART of Esau was TOLD to Rebekah (Gen 27:41-42). Praise the Lord! Rebekah warns Jacob to flee the scene and to go to Laban, her brother in Haran to take a wife from that land. Jacob leaves with a heavy heart obeying his mother.

Here, this is what the Lord showed me in this story. Many might disagree and you can very well do so, because that is your right. But this is what my dear heavenly Father showed me.

Isaac is a type of the Father Himself, Esau is a type of Israel as a nation, Jacob as the Church, Rebekah as the Holy Spirit and the two kids together are the sacrifice of the Lord Jesus Christ. With these things in mind we will discuss this incident.

God the Father loved Israel but because Israel disobeyed and fell into spiritual adultery, which was an abomination unto God, the Lord God was not at all happy with Israel. Notwithstanding the Lord kept correcting His eldest son Israel in the ways of His choosing. Now when the time to bless came, Esau (Israel) who had married the daughters of Heth, did not know himself how to cook. So he had to go to the daughters of Heth, who were Gentiles and idolaters, to get the dish ready for his father. The Hittite women were a grief to the parents of Esau. How could Isaac love the preparation of these pagan people? If he had eaten I think he would have cursed them and Esau instead of blessing. If not cursing, he would not have blessed Esau with true heart completely. The children of Israel (Esau) never listened to the voice of the Holy Spirit (Rebekah), which cried unto them every morning. They went on whoring from one god to another and with this sinful life, how could they bring an offering to God and that too according to His pleasing?

Rebekah, who heard this conversation of her husband with Esau, took Jacob (the Church), who was not worthy to become the firstborn and PREPARED him to present before the Father. (Romans 8:16   The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:) to stand worthy by the sacrifice of those two kids (Jesus Christ), which were a sin offering (Leviticus 16:5   And he shall take of the congregation of the children of Israel two kids of the goats for a sin offering, and one ram for a burnt offering.). That sin offering which was the sacrifice was for making Jacob worthy to stand before his father Isaac. To wit, Jesus sacrifice is for us, the Church to stand worthy before our heavenly Father as a Firstborn. Only Rebekah knew what Isaac loved (Gen 27:9,14). Only the Holy Spirit knows what makes sweet smelling savor unto the Father. The wrath of God fell upon Jesus Christ completely, so that we are made worthy to be His Children. In Jesus we have our birthright, sold out by Israel. When we go to the Father, we cannot just go before Him, unless we have the garments of the Firstborn, Israel, the smell of the Firstborn in us. When we go to the Father, we put on Jesus Christ (Galatians 3:27   For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.), by which God the Father recognizes us as His Firstborn and when He accepts the offering as a sweetsmelling savour (Ephesians 5:2   And walk in love, as Christ also hath loved us, and hath given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweetsmelling savour.) unto Himself. Then shall we receive the blessing of the Eternal Life, the blessing of the inheritance of His Kingdom. Israel took this blessing very lightly and lost it until the time appointed, when they will come back to the Father in the last days.

Genesis 27:30   And it came to pass, as soon as Isaac had made an end of blessing Jacob, and Jacob was yet scarce gone out from the presence of Isaac his father, that Esau his brother came in from his hunting.

“Before thou camest”.

Genesis 27:33   And Isaac trembled very exceedingly, and said, Who? where is he that hath taken venison, and brought it me, and I have eaten of all before thou camest, and have blessed him? yea, and he shall be blessed.

When the Son of man will come down from heaven, Israel will weep, they shall mourn just like Esau mourned.

Genesis 27:34   And when Esau heard the words of his father, he cried with a great and exceeding bitter cry, and said unto his father, Bless me, even me also, O my father.

Genesis 27:38   And Esau said unto his father, Hast thou but one blessing, my father? bless me, even me also, O my father. And Esau lifted up his voice, and wept.

The Lord has set out His plans long time back, yea, even before the world began and that is why it is written that Jesus died for us before the foundations of the world were laid.

Glory in the Highest!

Post-trib rapture believers points

Explaining Post-Tribulation Rapture Believers Points

(I thought of editing in introduction to this post as I did not want to appear an angry person but being an image of God, I want to show forth His word seasoned with grace and gentleness, which is the fruit of His Spirit.)

I have a burden to put these points in this blog so that you may ponder and by His grace, come to your own conclusion by being in prayer. This is all for the glory of the Father Whom I love and for the edification of the Church, the body of Christ, of whose I am.

Our heavenly Father, the Creator of heaven and earth and all that is therein, we come before You in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, Your only begotten Son, Who died for us and loved us so much that He took the wrath on Himself on the cross; of which You approved in the garden of Gethsemane, because You saw that Your Bride was sleeping and that She was not ready to drink the cup. Lord, now that we are redeemed, You have called each one of us by our name and we are Yours, Father. Forgive us of all our sins and wash us with Your precious blood. Father, we seek the knowledge of Your Kingdom and Your plans and You are ready to give to us, if we are hungry and thirsty. You said “Open your mouths wide and I will fill it”. Lord, we open our mouths as chicks do right now, feed us with Your eternal Manna, Your Holy Word, for You are our faithful Father. Give us wisdom to understand Your word that we may rejoice in the revelation of Your mysteries. Father, bless each and every reader here and let everyone that reads this run. Thank You, dear Father in Jesus’ holy name, Amen.

The following are just a few points but right now I remember only these. If you have anything else in your mind, you can also put them in comments so that I could learn as well.

1. Mat 24:29-31 – After the Tribulation

The post tribulation rapture believers emphatically say that the Lord would come IMMEDIATELY AFTER the tribulation and keep arguing that Jesus will come AFTER and not BEFORE the tribulation and that is when they say that the rapture takes place. So let us look into it.

Matthew 24:29-31   Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: / And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. / And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Most post-tribulation rapture believers believe that we are not appointed to wrath according to 1 Thessalonians 5:9   For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

But they will find it difficult in reconciling with Mat 24:29-31.

Will Jesus come immediately after the tribulation? No, but the sun shall be darkened and the moon shall not give her light and the stars shall fall from heaven……. But what exactly is this event?

Revelation 6:12 -17  And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; / And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. / And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. / And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; / And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: / For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

It is clear that this event is nothing but the wrath of God. Some post-tribulation rapture believers argue that the 6^th seal is NOT the wrath of God and they say that the ‘wrath is come’ here, can be interpreted as ‘the wrath is YET TO COME’, that is, a future event.

Now we will see that the cosmic events are in itself the wrath of God.

Isaiah 13:9-10   Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it. / For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

Immediately AFTER the tribulation, there would be wrath of God and THEN (Mat 24:30) shall appear the sign of the Son of man and: THEN shall all the tribes of the earth (not the Church) mourn, and THEY (not YOU: the Church) shall see the Son of man coming….

So the order of events are:

Tribulation (After the tribulation) —->Wrath (Cosmic events) —->Elect Gathered

Jesus does not come BEFORE the cosmic events, that is before the wrath. This contradicts the belief that we are not appointed to wrath.

2. 2 The 2 – Day of Christ

2 Thessalonians 2:1-3   Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, / That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. / Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

The post-tribulation rapture believers say that the rapture will not happen until the Antichrist is revealed first. But let us see what the scriptures really have to say here.

Verse 1: Paul is asking the Thessalonians to do something here CONCERNING the coming of the Lord and CONCERNING the gathering together unto Him.

And what is that something?

Verse 2: That something is; not to be soon shaken in mind (be quickly upset or disturbed or agitated), or be troubled (frightened or confused), as that the day of Christ (wrath) has come.

Why would anyone be troubled if the day of Christ is the day of redemption (rapture)? Should not the Thessalonians, who were already troubled and were in terrible tribulation, being persecuted, be rejoicing at His coming, if the day of Christ is the day of the rapture? But that is not the case, because it was clear that they knew that the day of Christ is the day of God’s wrath and they thought they had missed the rapture, spoken by Paul in 1 Th 4:16-18 and had felt left behind to face that Great Day of the Lord.

Verse 3: That this Great Day of the Lord/Christ, the day of His wrath will not come, except the Antichrist is revealed first.

Post-tribulation rapture believers make this ‘for that day shall not come’ as the day of rapture (gathering – Verse 1), which is not true at all. Because just in the previous verse, we saw what day Paul was talking about. He was talking about the day of Christ, the day of the Lord, the wrath of God.

2 Th 2:5-8 – Restrainer

2 Thessalonians 2:5-8   Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things? / And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.  / For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. / And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

The post-tribulation rapture believers say that the one that ‘witholdeth’ or a restrainer here is NOT the Holy Spirit. Some of them say that the ‘he’ here is God’s timing. Paul clearly puts a personal pronoun here as ‘he’, and calling it some kind of timing does not really add up. Some of them say that it is again some evil/iniquity (mystery of iniquity) itself which is holding the man of sin to be revealed. How can Satan restrain himself?

The right way of interpreting is that it is the Holy Spirit that restrains the man of sin. Does anyone pray without faith? Why do we have to pray if we do not believe that Satan is going to be restrained by the power of the Holy Ghost? If we do not believe, then is our prayer vain.

Now, ‘He’, the restrainer is taken OUT OF THE WAY, which means that He was standing in the way of this man of sin, who was to be revealed. Once He is taken out of the way, the Antichrist will come like an unleashed dog and will rule cruelly but for a short time.

4. 1 Th 4:15-17 – Resurrection

 1 Thessalonians 4:15   For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

Verse:15 is a very strong verse for the defense of post tribulation rapture doctrine because it talks about the COMING OF THE LORD.

One has to remember that rapture event is totally different from the Second coming of Christ, when He Himself will descend on the mount of Olives and that is not mentioned in the following verses. Therefore, the Lord comes in the clouds to rapture His Church and THEN the dead in Christ shall arise FIRST and then we which are alive and remain (unto the coming of the Lord) shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air. We do not meet the Lord on earth (mount of Olives) but in the air. We will look for the proof of this rapture event at the end of this point.*

 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17   For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: / Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

The post-tribulation rapture doctrine believes that because the resurrection of the dead does not happen until the end of the tribulation, the rapture will not happen until then.

Revelation 20:4-5   And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. / But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Anybody who sees at first will definitely conclude that the first resurrection takes place in Rev 20, which is obviously not only AFTER the Tribulation but also after the wrath.

However, there is another resurrection (second) AFTER the millennium, in Rev 20:5 & Rev 20:12-15.  Revelation 20:12-15   And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. / And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.  / And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. /And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Now there is a proof that there are two resurrections; First Resurrection BEFORE the millennium and the Second Resurrection AFTER the millennium. The Lord says in Revelation 20:6  Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years. 

The partakers of the First Resurrection are called blessed and holy because the there is no condemnation for them as they are born again and have walked after the Spirit and not after the flesh. But the partakers of the Second were judged according to their works. ONLY THOSE whose names were written in the book of life were going to live with God but the rest will perish. So, ALL those who will be in the second resurrection will not be saved.

We have resurrections and will have resurrections before Rev 20:4-5

a)    Saints following the Lord’s resurrection

 Matthew 27:52-53   And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, / And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

b)    Twenty four elders before the throne

Revelation 5:8-9   And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints. /And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

Only humans were redeemed by His blood and they were out of every kindred, and tongue and people and nation. So they cannot be angels.

c)    Two witnesses resurrected on the third day of their death

  Revelation 11:11-12   And after three days and an half the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them. /And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.

So all these resurrections COMBINED make one resurrection and that is the FIRST resurrection and anyone who is the partaker of this resurrection need not fear the second death. BUT those who will be the partaker of the SECOND resurrection after one thousand years are fulfilled, they need to fear because if their works are not good according to the books and their names are not written in the book of life, they would be cast out, which is Second Death.

* So now we know that the catching up of the living will not happen at the end, that is the rapture.

5. Last day(s)

John 6:40   And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 6:44   No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 6:54   Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 11:24   Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.

John 12:48   He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

Now let us consider below two verses:

John 6:40   And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 12:48   He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

We have already seen above that during the First Resurrection there is no condemnation. The final judgment of condemnation is found at the Second Resurrection. From the above two verses we can conclude that a believer and an unbeliever in Jesus Christ will be raised at the last day; one to inherit the Kingdom of God and the other to partake the fire of hell respectively. So to quote these verses and say that the rapture takes place at the last day will raise many other questions.

The Old Testament saints knew about only one resurrection and that is the second resurrection and they spoke about it.

Job 14:12   So man lieth down, and riseth not: till the heavens be no more, they shall not awake, nor be raised out of their sleep.

Daniel 12:2-3   And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. / And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.

This is the resurrection which Martha believed and mentioned to the Lord but Jesus said “I am the resurrection, and the life” because was He was going to become the firstborn of the resurrection.

6. 1 Cor 15:51-52 – the Last Trump

  1 Corinthians 15:51-52   Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, / In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

They say that the trumpet here is the last of the 7 trumpets of the angels sounding during the tribulation period and hence say that the rapture must happen during this time. This also is a very strong verse for the post-tribulation rapture doctrine.

Let us look what happens at the 7^th trumpet and thereafter:

Revelation 11:15-19   And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. / And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God, / Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned. / And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth. / And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

When the 7^th angel sounds his trumpet, there were voices from heaven. We do not know whose voices are these. But in 16^th verse we know that the twenty four elders, who are already resurrected are worshipping God before His throne, who:

a)    say “we give thee thanks……which art, and wast, and art TO COME…” He has not come yet, but is STILL GOING TO COME.

b)    also say ‘….Thy wrath is come’ which means that His wrath is yet to come?

c)    also say ‘and the time of dead that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto Thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear Thy name, small and great; and destroy them which destroy the earth’ The dead were not yet raised but would be raised AFTER the wrath is come and THEN all would be judged.

From the above exposition it is clear that the dead will only be raised and judged AFTER His wrath. Does any of the verses talk about the great event, the rapture? No. But Paul makes it so clear when and how this great event takes place. AFTER the sounding of the trumpet by the 7^th angel, John does not even mention that the Lord Jesus descends from heaven. If He is descending then what were the twenty four elders doing there instead of coming down with the Lord? As it is written in Rev 19, that saints will follow Jesus.

One may say that the chapters in the book of Revelation are not written in chronological order and I agree to some extent but I can also prove that there is a gap between 7^th trumpet and the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ and that gap is the 7 vial judgment, during which period the Lord is not here on earth yet. Let us see that.

AFTER the 7^th trumpet has sounded, the vial judgments are poured out and after the 7^th vial is poured out the Whore, Mystery, Babylon the great was judged.

Revelation 16:17-19  And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done. /  And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great. / And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath. 

We know that Rev 17 and 18 are the judgments of this Babylon and later in Rev 19 John mentions the second coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Revelation 19:1-2   And after these things I heard a great voice of much people in heaven, saying, Alleluia; Salvation, and glory, and honour, and power, unto the Lord our God: / For true and righteous are his judgments: for he hath judged the great whore, which did corrupt the earth with her fornication, and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand.

Here it proves just before the Coming of Our Lord, the people are already there in heaven who cry out praising Him saying “……..hath judged the Great Whore….”.

Hence, the timeline would be something like this:

7^th trumpet—-7 vials (wrath of God)—-Babylon Judged—-Second coming—-Antichrist Judged.

Some post-tribulation rapture believers try to squeeze the Second coming and the 7^th trumpet at the same time leaving aside the vial judgments, which they say the 7 vial judgments and the judgment of Babylon and the judgment of the Antichrist and the false prophet, are all the same and happen in one day. This is absolutely impossible. Why?

Let us look, for example, what happens in the pouring out of 6^th vial:

 Revelation 16:12-14   And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared. /   And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet. / For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.

Revelation 16:16   And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.

After the 6^th vial is poured out, the evil spirits go out and provoke all the kings of the earth and of the whole world to gather them to the battle of Armageddon. It is impossible to gather all of them in one place in ONE DAY and destroy them in ONE DAY.

They also say that the Whore is judged in 5^th vial itself because Babylon is riding on the beast, which is the seat of the beast, on which the vial is poured.

Revelation 16:10-11   And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain, / And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.

But if she is judged in 5^th vial itself, then why does she come into remembrance before God to judge her after 7^th vial is poured, Rev 16:19?

Again, if the Lord destroys the Antichrist and the false prophet by the brightness of His coming, then who will judge the Whore; because it is the ten kings of the beast who will destroy the Whore? The leader of the ten kings is the Antichrist himself.

2 Thessalonians 2:8   And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

Revelation 17:16   And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.

Finally, whichever the case is, whether the Lord will come at the 7^th trumpet in Rev 11 or the 7^th trumpet is blown in Rev 19, the Church has to face the 7 vial judgment, which is the wrath of God. This theory absolutely contradicts their own faith that the Church is not appointed to wrath.

7. 1 Th 5:9 – We are not appointed to wrath

1 Thessalonians 5:9   For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

This they interpret that Paul is talking about hell and it has nothing to do with rapture or wrath during the tribulation.

I have not seen anywhere the Lord saying that His wrath is poured out on hell. Wherever the wrath of God is mentioned it is always about the earth. Hell is a place prepared for the devil and his angels, where there is lot of pain and suffering.

1 Thessalonians 1:10   And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.

In the above verse, we see that the wrath is to come. There is a time appointed for wrath, while we see that hell always exists. It was there during the Old Testament times, it is still there even now and will be there for eternity, where the devil and his angels will spend their eternity. If hell is the wrath of God, then the Lord would not have appointed a fixed time for that. But there is always a time of wrath which is going to come at the set time, somewhere in the future. Let us also look few verses here.

1 Thessalonians 2:16   Forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they might be saved, to fill up their sins alway: for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost.

Colossians 3:6   For which things’ sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:

Ephesians 5:6   Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.

Romans 2:5   But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God; 

Romans 1:18   For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

Luke 3:7   Then said he to the multitude that came forth to be baptized of him, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?

Zephaniah 1:15   That day is a day of wrath, a day of trouble and distress, a day of wasteness and desolation, a day of darkness and gloominess, a day of clouds and thick darkness,

Therefore, it is clear that we are NOT APPOINTED TO THAT SET TIME OF WRATH OF GOD.

Also, Paul speaks expressly before this chapter 5 of 1 Thessalonians about the Day of the Lord which is the wrath of God.

1 Thessalonians 5:1-2   But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. / For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

8. Rev 3:10 Keep thee from the temptation 

Revelation 3:10   Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

If we look closely how the Lord speaks this particular verse, we could very easily conclude that the Great Tribulation is not for the Church. The first part of this verse is the quality of the Philadelphia Church that they have kept the word of His patience and therefore the Lord will keep them from the hour of temptation. The second part tells us on whom the temptation is going to come and for what. The temptation is going to come upon all the world. Why is the temptation coming? To try. To try whom? The Church? No. But to try them that dwell upon the earth. Now, if the post-tribulation rapture believers are keen on saying that the Church needs to be tried to be found worthy, then why is the Lord not keen on trying the Church? Why is the Lord going to try THEM (not you) that dwell upon the earth and NOT the Church? 

9. Luk 21:31 Escape all these things 

Luke 21:34   And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.
Luke 21:35   For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.
Luke 21:36   Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.  

Like as we have seen in the above point, it becomes clear even here that the Lord is telling that the Day of the Lord, that is the Great Tribulation is going to come on them (not you) that dwell on the face of the whole earth. While he is warning the people to be watchful lest they become the partakers of this terrible time. 

1. Mat 24:21 Great tribulation like it never was before nor ever shall be

Matthew 24:21   For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

Post-tribulation rapture believers often ask. ‘Jesus suffered, why won’t we? The early church suffered, why are we spared?’ We suffer too. You cannot pull out every ‘tribulation’ word from the Bible and try to allude that to the Great Tribulation that is going to come. Most of us know there is a difference between the General Tribulation that has been on the Church and the Great Tribulation that is going to come in the future. But just because we are not able to explain the difference convincingly, it becomes hard for post-tribulation rapture believers believe. The Lord showed me by the Holy Spirit, one very significant and apparent difference and here is the explanation:

The Church is going through persecution since the time of Pentecost and the Church has been growing. How? The only reason why the persecuted Church members are so strong during the trials is because of the grace of God. Without the grace of God it is impossible to survive and stand for the truth. Even Paul was shaken by the thorn in the flesh (2 Cor 12:7-8) that had been troubling him and the Lord’s answer to Him was “My grace is sufficient for thee”. Without the grace and mercy of the Lord, it is impossible to face the enemy.

While we see from Mat 24:21, that the Great Tribulation would be so bad that such was not since the beginning of the world to that time, no, nor ever shall be. If the trouble would be so terrible, then what would the Church do, if according to the post-tribulation rapture believers the Church is going through this horrible time? Obviously, the abundance of the grace of God should be so much that the world had never experienced until that time. BUT is that what we find in the book of Revelation during this time? We do not find one word of grace, mercy, compassion, lovingkindness or anything that at least gives us a hint of the Church getting help from the Lord, in the book of Revelation. Did John miss something here? I do not think so. It is obvious that the time of grace will come to an end. There would not be any grace to the Gentiles. All that is left is for the Jews; especially the remnant, who are 144000 from twelve tribes of the Children of Israel.

The Church has been suffering for a couple of thousand years and we all have been suffering. Only because some Americans and other developed nation believers do not feel the suffering, does not mean that no other Christians in this world are suffering and hence everybody has to go through the coming Great Tribulation, which is for the whole world. 

1. Rev 7:14 Out of Great Tribulation 

Revelation 7:9   After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
Revelation 7:10   And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.
Revelation 7:11   And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God,
Revelation 7:12   Saying, Amen: Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. Amen.
Revelation 7:13   And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
Revelation 7:14   And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.  

John the revelator sees a great multitude from all nations, kindreds, people and tongue standing before the throne. One of the elders explains who this Great Multitude is. The elder tells him that that they are they which came out of Great Tribulation.

Now, in verse 9 of the chapter, John SEES the multitude at that time already standing before the throne of God and the Lamb. John does not see them coming out of great tribulation which at that time would have been going on earth in full swing. Here the Great Tribulation mentioned in verse 14 does not mean the Great Tribulation that the world is going to see very soon. It is general tribulation that everyone has faced individually or collectively. I am so sure because of the question that came into my mind: Will St.Paul, Barnabas, Iraneus, David Wilkerson, D L Moody and all Christians (in short, the dead in Christ) since the time of resurrection of Jesus Christ be among that Great Multitude?

If yes, then how could they have gone through the coming Great Tribulation?

If no, then what happened to all of them?

The only conclusion we can derive is that this great multitude is raptured and is in the presence of the Lord, before the throne of God as each of them are arrayed in white robes, washed in the blood of the Lamb.

2. Rev 12:11 They overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and they loved not their lives unto the death. 

Revelation 12:11   And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.  

We need to first read the whole chapter to understand the timing of the event. In summary: John first sees the event happening in heaven as a sign in verses 1-3: A woman with man child is in travail and the dragon, Satan is waiting for her to deliver the man child so that he can devour the man child. Verses 4-6 tell us the actual event happening here on earth. Satan, before himself is cast down, draws a third part of the stars of heaven to the ground and then when the woman delivers the child, the child is caught up immediately unto God. The woman flees to the wilderness for a thousand two hundred and sixty days. After the war in heaven Michael casts the dragon and his angels to the earth.

Then there is a loud voice in heaven which sings salvation and strength, Kingdom of our God and the power of Christ has come. Why? Because ‘the accuser of our brethren is cast down’ and these brethren OVERCAME the dragon by the blood of the Lamb. Now, the word OVERCAME is in past tense, which means the brethren are not GOING TO OVERCOME IN THE FUTURE but rather they have already overcome the dragon. So there is no question of these brethren (Church) being in this earth.

The verse, saying “they loved not their lives unto the death” only says that they (any Christian) did not love their lives unto their death; here death could also be a natural death and not necessarily a martyr’s death. You could live all life as a Christian, loving the Lord and die a natural and a peaceful death nearing your age of 100 years. That does not mean that you loved your life. At every instant you rejected the pleasures of this life and accept the pain and suffering of this world for the sake of Christ. I am sure every true believer in Christ hates his life and denies himself and follows Christ, otherwise he is not worthy to become His disciple.

Thirdly in verse 12: if the Church was to be there in this world, the loud voice in heaven in this chapter would not have said the heavens to rejoice and woe unto the earth. How is it possible that the Bride of Christ is still in this earth and going through such a terrible persecution, with every member of the Bride crying out to the Lord in pain and suffering and then this heavenly voice calls out trouble to the earth while the heavens to rejoice. I find it very ridiculous to think the heavens saying that way to the Church of God here on earth.

This again proves that the rapture is not going to be a Post-Tribulation. 

There are many other points to defend a pre-tribulation rapture, which God willing, would post in some other blog.